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 Post subject: Diesel Transfercase Swap Questions
 Post Posted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 3:53 am 
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Killed his Hooptie Geo Prism
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Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 8:49 pm
Posts: 202
Location: Fort Wayne, IN
Disclaimer: Like most all my questions, this just an academic exercise.
I am a fact finder, trying to educate myself.

************************************************** ***
As some may know, I have a '93 GMC 3500 series van powered by a 6.2L Diesel and a 4L80E transmission
The 4L80E is bad.
My present goals are to repair/rebuild the 4L80E and drive the van.
Since it is an extended length van I could use it to haul stuff, like Scout gear to campouts, etc..
Also, this will give me some time to evaluate the 6.2L.
I would like to replace the injectors and maybe its Stanadyne DB2 Injector pump.
There is a fear that I may like this van so much, I may just keep it as is.
But, its tractor like ride may break me of wanting to keep it (#9000+ GVW)

Once I decide to swap this drivetrain into either my Wagoneer or my J10, I have a couple of decision to make, thus my questions.

I do not know what transfercase to go with.
I know I want to keep the 4L80E and I know it will need to be torn down again to have the correct 4WD output shaft installed.

One the thing that effects this decision is the drop of the front axle.
Presently, my J10 has a Dana44 with a driver's side drop.
But, if I want to use the GM Corp 14Bolt FF from the van to replace the M23 rear axle, I would want to swap in a front axle (like a Dana44HD) to match the rear axle.
What 8lug HD front axles are easy to locate?

Okay, I know my answers are..."well depends on this if you want to use that" and that is what has me confused.

Review Questions
1. What side drop front axle would I want to seek out?
2. What transfercase should I locate that would work behind the 4L80E and the front axle from Question 1?

Once I have these concerns solved, my next challenges are shifters.
Like what shifter would I use for the transfercase?
How would make the 4L80E work with the OE Jeep Column Shifter.
My desire is to keep the floor clean and not clutter the floor with a bunch of shifters.

_________________
Bryan Smith
2004 KIA Optima (wife 's DD)
1999 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited (my DD)
1993 GMC 3500 extended length cargo van, 6.2L Diesel powered.
1982 J10 - current project, replacement AMC 360 sitting in the engine bay.
1981 J20 - stock with a super kewl commercial flat bed (stored, long term Diesel dually project)


Last edited by The PIG Smith on Tue Apr 22, 2008 9:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 9:41 am 
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mister wiskers
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Posts: 1631
Location: For Twain, In Dianna
First, let me define some of the lingo I have a tendancy to use. If I refer to Chevy axles, I am generally talking about a pre-88 with the Dana 44, or a pre-91 with the 60. Both of which are passenger side drop, to the best of my knoweledge. I am also refering to earlier Dodge axles, as they, too, were passenger side drop.

If I refer to Ford axles, they are driver side drop.


Now, in my opinion, running the 6.2 in front of the 4L80E will not harm a Chevy 44. However, If you want strength beyond strength, the Ford 60 is the way to go, as it is also a high pinion axle, and the high pinion is STRONG in a front axle application. All are available in 8 lug configuration.

As far as a T-case goes, I like passenger side drop for many reasons, including having a place for everything when you are installing the drivetrain. Steering goes on left, diff is on the right. However, if you don't want a shifter on the floor, you will need to go with the newer models of T-case, which are driver side drop. I don't know all the model numbers, but I know you case get a version of the NP241 in Ford drop, vacuum shift. For the Chevy drop, I don't know of any that don't need a floor shifter.





Cliff notes;


Ford HP 60, Vacuum shift 241.

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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 10:23 am 
where do yer scouts meet?


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 1:53 pm 
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Killed his Hooptie Geo Prism
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Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 8:49 pm
Posts: 202
Location: Fort Wayne, IN
Thanx for the "Food for Thought"
You mentioned several things that I had not thought about.

First, I do not need gobs of a strength, so a high dollar, high strength, 1 ton Dana60 front axle is not required.
I am wanting a 3/4 ton axle, something like a Dana44HD that has a 8 lug hubs to match my 14bolt rear axle.

You got me thinking about the floor in my '82 J10.
It's tranny hump is for a driver's side drop.
The pre-'79 FSJ have tranny humps for a passenger side drop.
So, I dunno how much a big deal this floor sheet metal is...so maybe a driver's drop maybe the best?

But as you mentioned, Chevy's are passenger side drop and I am guessing they would be easier to locate a donor.
So am I guessing, as of now, that I will concentrate my efforts on locating an axle and transfercase from a GM product.

While I am guessing, just about any NP transfercase will work.
I know that Chevy installed NP241 behind a 4L80E.
So, I will be on the look out for a GM front axle.
As I mentioned, this a long term project, but I like to have a good plan, so if I run across a good deal, I can jump on it.

_________________
Bryan Smith
2004 KIA Optima (wife 's DD)
1999 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited (my DD)
1993 GMC 3500 extended length cargo van, 6.2L Diesel powered.
1982 J10 - current project, replacement AMC 360 sitting in the engine bay.
1981 J20 - stock with a super kewl commercial flat bed (stored, long term Diesel dually project)


Last edited by The PIG Smith on Tue Apr 22, 2008 9:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 12:08 pm 
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Killed his Hooptie Geo Prism
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Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 8:49 pm
Posts: 202
Location: Fort Wayne, IN
kellyd469 wrote:
where do yer scouts meet?

WOW!
I am really SLOOWWWWW...Sorry...

I think from this other posting, I kinda/sorta answered this question:[url=http://bbb.jeepininin.com/viewtopic.php?t=14379]
pinewood derby cars *pic of done car[/url]

Cub Scout Pack 3015 meets at Grace Presbyterian Church, located at 1811 Fairhill Road, Fort Wayne, IN 46808
The Pack meets every Tuesday at 6:30 to about 8:30ish

Boy Scout Troop 15 meets at the same place every Monday from 7:00 to about 9:00ish

_________________
Bryan Smith
2004 KIA Optima (wife 's DD)
1999 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited (my DD)
1993 GMC 3500 extended length cargo van, 6.2L Diesel powered.
1982 J10 - current project, replacement AMC 360 sitting in the engine bay.
1981 J20 - stock with a super kewl commercial flat bed (stored, long term Diesel dually project)


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 1:08 pm 
The PIG Smith wrote:
kellyd469 wrote:
where do yer scouts meet?

WOW!
I am really SLOOWWWWW...Sorry...

I think from this other posting, I kinda/sorta answered this question:[url=http://bbb.jeepininin.com/viewtopic.php?t=14379]
pinewood derby cars *pic of done car[/url]

Cub Scout Pack 3015 meets at Grace Presbyterian Church, located at 1811 Fairhill Road, Fort Wayne, IN 46808
The Pack meets every Tuesday at 6:30 to about 8:30ish

Boy Scout Troop 15 meets at the same place every Monday from 7:00 to about 9:00ish


hahaha...yup we had this discusion...lol :acclaim:


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 6:43 pm 
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Jeeper in IN
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Joined: Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:02 pm
Posts: 198
Location: new pal
:? you could keep the existing tranny, and get yourself a divorced ford 205 xfer case. you just run a stubby driveshaft from the trans to the xfer case, lengthens your front driveshaft too, giving you a better angle.


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 6:54 am 
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Killed his Hooptie Geo Prism
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Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 8:49 pm
Posts: 202
Location: Fort Wayne, IN
MojoMot wrote:
:? you could keep the existing tranny, and get yourself a divorced ford 205 xfer case. you just run a stubby driveshaft from the trans to the xfer case, lengthens your front driveshaft too, giving you a better angle.

That's a good idea.
I would need to find a divorced unit with a crossmember attached to help with the mounting issues.
Getting the shifter from the donor would be a major plus as well.
I have not seen one of these in a very long time.
Wonder how common they are?

_________________
Bryan Smith
2004 KIA Optima (wife 's DD)
1999 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited (my DD)
1993 GMC 3500 extended length cargo van, 6.2L Diesel powered.
1982 J10 - current project, replacement AMC 360 sitting in the engine bay.
1981 J20 - stock with a super kewl commercial flat bed (stored, long term Diesel dually project)


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 7:01 am 
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Killed his Hooptie Geo Prism
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Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 8:49 pm
Posts: 202
Location: Fort Wayne, IN
I have a fellow Scout leader that is bigtime Chevy enthusiast and he has all kinds of sources for truck parts.
He told me he has a buddy that kinda/sorta runs a small junk yard at his farm.
I am told this yard has several diesel trucks (mostly 6.5L with bad motors) with good trannys and that I might be able to pick up a Diesel 4L80E for $400.

So...I would stick the junk yard unit in my van and run with it.
Next, I would take my time to rebuild my current bad unit with all the updates, modifications, 4WD output shaft, etc...

Later, I might look into picking up a complete Turbo setup from a bad 6.5L

_________________
Bryan Smith
2004 KIA Optima (wife 's DD)
1999 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited (my DD)
1993 GMC 3500 extended length cargo van, 6.2L Diesel powered.
1982 J10 - current project, replacement AMC 360 sitting in the engine bay.
1981 J20 - stock with a super kewl commercial flat bed (stored, long term Diesel dually project)


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:32 am 
Offline
Killed his Hooptie Geo Prism
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 8:49 pm
Posts: 202
Location: Fort Wayne, IN
Stuka from the IFSJA forum wrote:
The 14bolt is a near bolt in for a FSJ, but its also much wider than the stock rear axle (67" vs ~70").
Which means you need to find a wider front axle.
The stock front axle is already narrower than the stock rear.


My 14bolt has 4:10 gears and now I learn is too wide, I think I will stick with my rear AMC M23 and front Dana 44 for foreseeable future.
As my front Dana44 has a driver's side diff...looks as I have narrowed my search for a transfercase down to a driver's side drop.

_________________
Bryan Smith
2004 KIA Optima (wife 's DD)
1999 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited (my DD)
1993 GMC 3500 extended length cargo van, 6.2L Diesel powered.
1982 J10 - current project, replacement AMC 360 sitting in the engine bay.
1981 J20 - stock with a super kewl commercial flat bed (stored, long term Diesel dually project)


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 10:09 pm 
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Jeeper in IN
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Joined: Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:02 pm
Posts: 198
Location: new pal
The PIG Smith wrote:
MojoMot wrote:
:? you could keep the existing tranny, and get yourself a divorced ford 205 xfer case. you just run a stubby driveshaft from the trans to the xfer case, lengthens your front driveshaft too, giving you a better angle.

That's a good idea.
I would need to find a divorced unit with a crossmember attached to help with the mounting issues.
Getting the shifter from the donor would be a major plus as well.
I have not seen one of these in a very long time.
Wonder how common they are?


i know someone who had 3 divorced cases a while back, sold all of em in 2 days, 350 each


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Fri Apr 25, 2008 3:20 pm 
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Killed his Hooptie Geo Prism
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Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 8:49 pm
Posts: 202
Location: Fort Wayne, IN
MojoMot wrote:
i know someone who had 3 divorced cases a while back, sold all of em in 2 days, 350 each

WOW! All gone in 2 days!
I sorta figured they were desirable.

_________________
Bryan Smith
2004 KIA Optima (wife 's DD)
1999 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited (my DD)
1993 GMC 3500 extended length cargo van, 6.2L Diesel powered.
1982 J10 - current project, replacement AMC 360 sitting in the engine bay.
1981 J20 - stock with a super kewl commercial flat bed (stored, long term Diesel dually project)


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